Tue 2 Oct 2007
Cantonese in the Mainland
Posted by 馬先生 under Cantonese
So I spent the last 6 days in Mainland China for a holiday. It wasn’t the complete culture shock being that road rules seem to not exist or sales assistants follow you everywhere you go that made me feel uncomfortable, it was that the so-called local language seemed to not exist.
廣州 - gwong2 zau1 - Guangzhou (the Capital of Cantonese) left me rather disappointed. It seemed that the majority are non-Cantonese people and simply refused to learn. You speak Cantonese, and you get replied back in Mandarin or extremely accented Cantonese. Not like Hong Kong where people know Cantonese but want to practice English, when I speak Cantonese they simply cannot speak it and continue in Mandarin until I stop them and they grab another person to help me in Cantonese. I get replies like “How is it possible that you know Cantonese and not Mandarin?”
When I actually found a local (seemed like 1 in 10 people), I was immediately elevated to “GOD” status. They loved me speaking Cantonese and treated me like a native Cantonese speaker.
On the other hand, 潮汕 - ciu4 saan3 - Chao Shan, being (潮州 - ciu4 zau1 - Chaozhou) and (汕頭 - saan3 tau4 - Shantou), two major Guangdong cities were both very limited in Cantonese. Some would reply in super broken Cantonese or Mandarin. Most people can understand Cantonese but can’t speak it well. If I spoke in Cantonese, then I couldn’t understand their Mandarin. Though shops would normally have a sales person who could speak Cantonese quite well and were happy to use Cantonese but with a heavier accent than mine.
In Guangdong, there is a vast amount of Cantonese resources. All Hong Kong television stations are available, and the Mainland even have many Cantonese TV and radio channels of their own. Though in Guangzhou, it still confuses me how people could learn to understand the language perfectly but couldn’t be bothered to open their mouths to speak Cantonese after 20 years of living there. I even saw many situations where one person spoke Cantonese and the other replied back in Mandarin. Seemed to be very popular in Guangzhou for people to speak their native language and receive replies in another.
This has not deterred me from learning Cantonese, or distracted me to take up Mandarin. On my return to Hong Kong and sharing my experience, my colleagues insisted that I should start learning Mandarin to be able to communicate with Mainland Chinese. However, many of them couldn’t speak Mandarin themselves, showing simply a double standards point-of-view on Chinese language.
I’m so sick of the learn Mandarin talk that I’ve listed why I shouldn’t learn it (pardon any ignorance):
1) No environment - Everyone including my family only speak Cantonese all the time.
2) I’m not interested in going to Shenzhen every weekend to practice Mandarin.
3) I’m not interested to learn Mandarin for short trips to China every year.
4) I’m not really interested in doing business in China (which it seems to be many people’s motivation).
5) Actually only 53% of Chinese people in China can speak Mandarin (source). So the exaggerated myth that 1.3 billion speakers cannot be as valued as wide spread languages like Spanish or French.
October 3rd, 2007 at 1:09 am
That’s interesting.I’ve already been to a city called Shao Guan,in Guandong province, and the situation was a bit the same. I was surprised by the amount of Mandarin spoken around me. I had the chance to visit a local school and they told me that the lessons are taught in Mandarin.And even when talking to one another some of them used Mandarin instead of Cantonese.However,from my experience, the ones who know Cantonese will talk to you without trying to revert it to English, even because they can’t speak it.
October 4th, 2007 at 1:45 am
wow….a trip to Shantou…nei5 gei3 m4 gei3 dak1 ngo5 hai2 saan3 tau4 zou6 je5?
October 4th, 2007 at 7:09 am
Hi Y, ah… Now I remember
October 4th, 2007 at 1:02 pm
stay positive man, i am trying my best to do so too
October 8th, 2007 at 5:31 am
In Chaozhou, the local dialect isn’t a Cantonese (yue) dialect, but rather a dialect similar to Taiwanese (minnan).
October 17th, 2007 at 2:15 pm
First of all I must say that I admire you for your efforts in learning Cantonese without any reading or writing the chinese characters(I can see now that you have finally changed your mind), which is quite the opposite of how I have learnt Chinese, the Putonghua (Mandarin), of course. I have been desperately fascinated by Cantonese ever since I can remember, but my chances of ever hearing it spoken live have never been too great, coming from a country where there are no Cantonese speakers at all. Finally I managed to get to Guangzhou, and from my experience-I have been here for about a month, your impressions of GZ city are completely wrong. Obviously a 6-day-tour of Guangzhou is not sufficient to make any final conclusions. CANTONESE IS SPOKEN ALL OVER GZ, in quantities enough for a person to pick up both the colloquial and the 標準 variant. And there are certainly enough Cantonese native speakers around that you can talk to. Maybe you have avoided taking a chance on the GZ buses, or mixing with the people in the most “Cantonese” places as 鬼佬 would usually do. Anyway, I think you are lucky to have a Chinese family and be able to live in a Chinese community. I have paid a lot of money just to come and be here for a while, and instead of getting a Cantonese one term course (it is not profitable nowadays with the business being done in Putonghua)-I had to settle for a Mandarin one. Well, it is the unification policy, and I agree with it. They are all Chinese after all, an ancient race unstoppably emerging on top of the world. I love them despite all their imperfections which can really make me mad sometimes. And both Cantonese and Mandarin will live, believe me. What more can I say? Keep it up, I am one of those desperate lovers of Cantonese you have helped with your website.
October 25th, 2007 at 5:05 am
I just wanted to point out (and rather to commenting people), that Cantonese, Mandarin, Minnan, etc are NOT dialect, but languages. That’s a huge difference
October 26th, 2007 at 6:40 am
I just found this website through the ‘Same Same But Different’.
I would like to learn Cantonese, ever since dating a native Hong Konger (no longer together), I’ve wanted to learn more than just a few words and sentences that she taught me. The problem is I can only teach myself, and trying to use it regulary is difficult..
I have considered ways of finding work in HK, but I’m a Film Student, and I doubt there’ll be any jobs going for someone without any experience in the industry and the UK film industry is almost non-existant…
Teaching English could be an option.
November 17th, 2007 at 10:11 am
Actually,everyone retrieves the cantonese story scarcely in Canton.He is growing death!!
December 3rd, 2007 at 1:44 am
this what happened to me the 1st time i went to 廣州 too. i’m a non chinese thats learned cantonese [luckily i can read & write too] & thought that 廣州 would be a great experiance before i went because i had spent lots of time in toisaan; but it was a culture warp! going to the mobile store to find help w/ my phone trying to find someone that could speak cantonese because the staff didn’t pseak english either……the cab ride was the best though: we were trying to get to a particular hotel to meet up w/ a cantonese friend & the cabbie was a transplant from somewhere else in the mandarin speaking world that thought he had an easy mark for a high fare. before we got in the cab i told him in cantonese that we wanted to go to the 花園酒店; which i knew was suppossed to be about 10 mins by cab from where we were, & his reponse was ‘o.k thats fine’ but then he starts driving us around in circles to up the fare & i when i called him on it he feigned ignorence & couldn’t understand canotnese. i got my pen out & wrote the characters out in simplified, put it up to the the partition & said that this was where we wanted to & that if we didnt get there NOW that we were going to tell the police about his game. then deflated he got us to the hotel in 2 mins. i do believe there are alot of cantonese speakers in GZ, but since the population is mixed w/ people from all over the map its a crap shoot to find one in a crowd. i also get the same thing about learning mandarin because its ‘better’ & this comes from native cantonese speakers! i tell them that i find cantonese the more useful than mandarin becuase i can use it in more places around the world they just scratch their heads.
August 2nd, 2008 at 6:55 am
Haha god you’re delusional. Not only do most people in China speak Mandarin, most top-tier jobs (lawyers, investment bankers, management consultants etc) need to speak Mandarin but don’t need to speak Cantonese. One only needs to look at this year’s Goldman Sachs hiring for Hong Kong. Only one Cantonese speaking person in the entire Investment Banking Division (the most money-making job in case you don’t know what I mean).