Sat 25 Aug 2007
1 year and 8 months of study
Posted by 馬先生 under Cantonese
After 1 year and 8 months of study, this is how my Cantonese sounds like in an impromptu speech. This was not scripted and the words just came freely from my brain without translations. So its all automatic so I’m bound to make some obvious mistakes.
For example, I said 不嬲 bat1 lau1, but should have said (經常 ging1 soeng4 / 成日 seng4 jat6). Also I used 觀點與角度 gun1 dim2 jyu5 gok3 dou6 incorrectly, but I knew these simple mistakes would definitely show when nervously recording.
When I first started learning, I only had to say a few words and get “praised”. Now I get criticised for bad accent and tone mistakes.
I really hope you can understand what I am saying, any comments?
Download - 00:58min
Hong Kong
August 25th, 2007 at 8:26 pm
OK. I’m taking the liberty to be the first one to comment on your Cantonese. I’ve been learning Cantonese for almost 3 year, and I think your Cantonese is much better than mine & much better than I had originally expected. Milan, you’re just too harsh on yourself.
August 25th, 2007 at 9:56 pm
It’s actually good and you should not be discouraged. It’s only a matter of time and plenty of practice before you reach ‘there’. My only advise (not that I’m qualified to!) is to use more colloquial expressions instead of written ones.
August 25th, 2007 at 10:34 pm
Quite good, but you still sound like a gwai lou. Practice more witt your tones and you will improve a bit more.
August 26th, 2007 at 12:03 am
HiHi, haven’t listen you speaking cantonese for a long time… :P, I can get 80%-85% Cantonese from what you said without guessing. I think it is good for you when people start criticising your cantonese for bad accent and mistake. That mean your cantonese level has been improved and people not treat you as a child anymore.
Workhard and pay more attention on the meaning of the words and get more practice with others..
Waiting for your next speech… and see your improvement later…Cya
August 26th, 2007 at 5:57 pm
Milan, for what it’s worth, your first sentence was pitch perfect… though it’s obvious when you tense up, pronunciation goes awry.
For 20 months of study, it’s impressive as even for the Chinese to learn a different Chinese dialect, takes around 5 years to get the pronunciation right (plus learn different vocabulary and grammar).
Heck, as a half-English-half-Chinese mutt that was born in Hong Kong though mostly have been in the UK since 1990, I still find it quite funny that local restaurant/shop staff speaking Mandarin to mainland customers… what starts of as Mandarin drifts off to Cantonese before the end of the sentence, yet these people are speaking it more or less every day for the last 10 years.
As 喵喵怪 says, when locals start criticising your Cantonese, it’s good enough to not for them to treat you like a “child”. There definitely still quite a disconnect seeing Westerners (even for me) conversing in pitch perfect Cantonese. With Mandarin being the “prestige” dialect (what English is in Europe and “the West”), Cantonese is like Icelandic… seeing two East Asians conversing in Icelandic whom are in London, New York or where ever, which I think would still cause a few double takes by more than a few people!
August 27th, 2007 at 10:56 am
Milan,
That was impressive. Looking forward for more clips like this one.
Like Jonathan said, you started off well, then got a few tonal mistakes towards the end.
I guess this is normal. When I speak Mandarin with people, after about 10 minutes into the conversation, I begin to mess things up.
August 29th, 2007 at 9:53 pm
Thank you everyone for the kind words of encouragement.
I can speak Cantonese without thinking in any English what so ever. Though naturally I will make tone mistakes and grammar mistakes as its all automatic.
I’m hoping over time, I will improve and sound more natural. Still my number 1 priority is understanding and vocabulary. Without a massive vocabulary, you simply can’t participate in discussions with natives unless they are talking like a baby to you. Also I don’t want to reply with “what does that word mean?” or “can you say that again?”
Luckily my wife speaks 100% Cantonese to me, so my listening and reflex skills have been well trained. However, of course my wife rarely corrects me because she simply understands and is used to my accent, tone mistakes and use of vocabulary. We simply communicate for understanding and I don’t treat her as my teacher in anyway what so ever. So this may lead to mistakes that I hope to self-correct after massive exposure to the language.
Thank you.
August 29th, 2007 at 10:24 pm
Hey Milan, thanks for posting the audio clip.
I could understand some words however my vocabulary is not as extensive as yours. I think when you said that you speak slowly, you can speak the tones well without accent is the key. Slowly, you will build up the ability to improve accent, tones and speak at normal speed but it only comes with a lot of speaking practice.
Keep posting audio clips in the future. Living in HK means that you can improve on a daily basis.
August 30th, 2007 at 8:32 am
Sounds great in my opinion, definitely too harsh on yourself in your last post/posts.
Haven’t had that much of a chance listening to foreigners speaking cantonese, and when i do the standard in GD from the people around me is pretty poor. The whole feel of the talking sounds quite natural and flows good, of course there are the tone mistakes.
Been nearly 5 years since i started learning, only 2 of those while living in a cantonese speaking area, and i need to say your level puts me at shame.
Keep up the good work, and look forward to more posts.
August 30th, 2007 at 10:00 am
hi milan, well done!
i am really glad to hear u speaking in cantonese again. it makes me feel proud to be cantonese to hear u learn it and now speak it.
keep the recordings coming. it is not easy to do adhoc recordings. perhaps u could read those transcripts instead of asking YY to do it.
hope to chat with u in msn next time we connect.
September 9th, 2007 at 6:39 am
Hi, Milan: I found this in Sheik’s Cantonese
forum today & thought you might like it,
but I don’t know how to send the link to you. However, I know you check your blogsite several times a day. So probably this is the best way to reach you!
September 9th, 2007 at 7:02 am
Sorry, I forgot to put the link in my last comment. Here it is!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xYUFUIn26Nc&v3
September 13th, 2007 at 11:28 pm
Frankly,I’m quite surprised by your Cantonese.Of course you make some grammar mistakes and sometimes mispronounce some words, but still I think this recording is pretty good. You can get the right rythm and melody of the language, shall we put this way.And the fact that people are now criticising your Cantonese clearly shows that they are now taking you seriously. I would take the criticisms as an encouragement,as they represent your progress in the language and they can show what your weaknesses are, so that you can work on improving them.
I look forward to listening to your next audio clip.
September 14th, 2007 at 4:02 pm
whoa, marcelo has a good point, i will remember that
September 15th, 2007 at 12:23 pm
hey, you have many supporters here
September 15th, 2007 at 1:20 pm
i can understand the whole clip, but i cannnt hear u last sentence 吃不到的葡萄是酸的
Maybe, u speak a bit faster. So i can’t hear each word clearly.
September 19th, 2007 at 3:41 pm
Without the ability to see that you aren’t Chinese I can’t tell that you’re not. You speak very well, keep it up! I hope to one day speak as well as you do now.
September 19th, 2007 at 3:44 pm
Without the ability to see that you’re not Chinese, I can’t tell. I think your Cantonese level is very good. Keep it up. One day I hope to be able to speak it as well as you do now.
September 25th, 2007 at 11:44 am
You’re a brave man. Given that, you will succeed in learning the language. In the clip, if were not reading from a script, I think people from the street in Hong Kong could understand at least 80% of what you say. So, good job! Even if you were reading from a script, it was still quite an impressive work!
February 6th, 2008 at 10:58 am
(Yes, I know, I’m commenting on a 6-month old clip…)
Okay, you definitely have an accent (and, as I suspected, your accent is obviously an English-speaking person’s accent, which is why the vendors didn’t buy it when you told them you didn’t speak English). BUT, that was so awesome for only 20 months of study! You are putting sentences together with the appropriate colloquialisms (sp?) as well as all the ah’s and gum lah’s at the end. At that rate, you must be very fluent today (six months later). I will bet that you still have an accent (because that’s hard to lose), but I think your word choice will be great and your accent will actually be much diminished. Good work!
October 9th, 2008 at 3:02 am
Where did you go? This is a very good blog. Took me entirely too long to find it.
I’m married to a HK native but live the US, and have been learning for about 3 years now - my progress is dismal. Found your blog while looking for other non-native speakers learning from partners or for family reasons.
Also, I visit HK every few years to be with family… it’s always nice to make new friends.